 . A Conversation With . By Kathryn M. Peters
Dear Friends of In Light Times, Joy-filled greetings to you all. The month of May is spinning delicious Spring dreams and love is in the air. On the subject of love this month's conversation is with the one and only Dr. 'Hugs', himself, Dr. Leo Buscaglia. Dr. Buscaglia (a personal hero of mine for many years) has authored more than one dozen books with over 11 million copies sold worldwide. For over three decades this splendiferous educator and passionate humanist has been cogently professing the need for all of us to learn the fine art of loving. My delightful conversation with this wonderful man focuses on loving and the family as we pay a tribute to the blessed miracle of every mother's love on this Mother's Day. kp: Good morning Dr. Buscaglia, how are you today? lb: I'm glorious, how are you? kp: I think I'm glorious, too, talking to you (laughter)I know that we have only 30 minutes, but I have to take at least two minutes to gush. lb: Oh, go ahead gush! kp: Okay, Dr. Buscaglia, I adore you. And this is such a thrill for me. I have a little story to tell you. When my publisher came to me asking who I wanted to interview this year for Mother's Day, and I said Leo Buscaglia, she asked "for Mother's Day?" lb: Of course, why not! kp: Exactly! You see, I'm a mother of six, and when I first started having my babies in the mid 70's, I read every book out there on how to have healthy children, wise children, happy children. But, Dr. Buscaglia, it was the stories about your upbringing and the passion that your mother raised you with that have stayed with me more than any other 'how to' book I've ever read. lb: Oh, now that is beautiful! That's not gush, Kathryn, that's glorious. You know, it's actually in the act that things happen, and my mother was one who was always out there doing. And that's how we learned. We educators all agree that we learn through modeling. Anyway I'm delighted that that has influenced your life. kp: Oh, the greatest influence. I have truly modeled my mothering after your mother's mothering. lb: Well, then, your kids are certainly mighty lucky. kp: Yes, they are, and they are fabulous children. So, I'll stop gushing and we'll get to our interview. Dr. Buscaglia, what was your mother's greatest gift to you? lb: Oh my goodness, she gave me so much. But the greatest gift my mother gave me was that she constantly let me know that I had unlimited potential. That I could grow, become and do precisely what I wanted to do. She taught me that the only interference would be self-imposed, certainly not anything that society or anybody else could impose. So it was the knowledge that I was unique and that I was special. Even though she had this house full of kids, she always found time to let each one of us know that. In fact, it was almost a daily message somehow spoken without preaching. It could have been a casual comment that she threw off. You know, sometimes we don't realize how powerful just a casual comment can be and especially when it comes from someone that you love and respect. When I did something, she would comment, "well, that is something I would expect from you, and I'm so pleased and proud." That's the kind of thing that made the difference. kp: What was the wisest thing that your mother ever said to you? lb: When my mother was dying and because of all she'd given us, we didn't want to leave her alone. So, there was somebody there 24 hours a day. We just took schedules and, since I was teaching late afternoon and evening classes, I would take the very, very late shift when there was a lot of silence and we were alone in the room. One evening I couldn't help but think about all she'd given me all of the wonder, the joy and the laughter. And as I quietly wept at her bedside, she opened her eyes. My mother looked at me, took my hand in hers, and said, "Felice, (which is something she called me all of her life), what are you holding onto?" And that was my moment of insight. I let go, and my life has been different ever since. It was amazing how she taught me right up to her last breath. kp: Now you say you let go and your life was different. What did you let go of and what changed? lb: Well, you see, Kathryn, my mother was peacefully dying and I was weeping, making her feel guilty for doing so. Yet, she was doing what she must do. And we are very wise when we come to realize that the harder we hold onto something, the more it runs through our fingers. So we always love with open arms, for this leads to hugs but not to holding on. kp: Dr. Buscaglia, what do you miss most about your mother? lb: Her sense of humor, I can say that without a moment's hesitation. She always found the bright side, the funny side and the humorous side of everything. Sometimes this was to the great annoyance of my father who was very serious about everything. You know, it was just like they were opposites. kp: They sound like a perfect compliment to me. lb: They were, but she laughed a lot and you know, that's one of the things I miss in our present society. I think we don't laugh enough today. We sit in front of television sets and we get artificial canned laughter. We don't laugh at our own experiences, and our own life, and mostly, we don't laugh at ourselves. I think when you stop laughing at yourself you are in serious trouble! kp: Well, why do you think that we forgot to do that? How did we forget to laugh? lb: Everyone keeps telling us how serious we must be; life is serious business. Well, you know, I'm sorry, but I don't think so. I think life is wonderful, light and airy, full of adventure, beauty, magic, mystery and miracles. I believe we have to take it in that sense. If you take everything seriously, it will drive you right out of this world. In wanting to be considered rational and intelligent human beings, we think we must see life as a very serious process. Consequently, we have lost our sense of humor and much of the joy in life. kp: That reminds me of that saying I love, "life is much too serious to take so seriously." lb: (Laughter) You know, we do what we can with it but life will have its way, it's like nature. I like very much the idea of the Indian man floating down a boat on the Ganges against the current and realizing that he wasn't getting anywhere. All at once he raised his oars, the boat turned around, floating in the direction it was meant to go and he began to sing. kp: Oh, that's lovely, and just let go and let God. Doctor, getting back to the family, you were so fortunate to have the kind of loving, passionate upbringing that you had lb: You bet I was kp: But for children who are not taught to love themselves the way you were, how do they go about learning to love themselves as adults? lb: Well, you know one of the things we are fast entering into, and it's really a kind of nice thing that is happening, because of divorce and remarriage, the family is constantly changing now and we are redefining what we mean by 'family'. I think we must reach out and bring in people of our choice, not people that are of our blood, but people that are of our choice and make them a part of our family. In this, the great thing we learn is that in order to have these people as part of our lives, we're going to exert energy, intelligence and sensitivity. We must do a lot of nurturing to build around ourselves a support system of beautiful people of our own choice with whom our children can interact, learning to love and be loved in return. It's a brand new challenge. kp: So, then Dr. Buscaglia, we're reinventing the extended family? lb: Yes, we must reinvent the extended family, exactly! I was at a meeting just recently at USC where there was much discussion about the need for the extended family, not only for the children but for adults, as they become elderly. This is a place where they feel secure, where they are loved, where they're not stashed away in some retirement community and forgotten. So, we were lucky to have all ages in our household. We were able to see the entire spectrum of life acted out before our eyes. We weren't afraid of aging because we saw that aging could be done with security, with love and with beauty. We weren't afraid of death because we were at the bedside of people we loved as they died, so none of these things were surprises. If we want to help children to grow, to live a healthy life, we're going to have to give them these experiences, even if it isn't in the nuclear family. kp: So what I hear you saying is that the crumbling of the nuclear unit isn't necessarily a bad thing, that it's helping us all to expand our horizons and to embrace more loving, open relationships with the world. lb: Yes, out of adversity almost always comes something good. Now, at the time, you may not be able to find it because adversity can require work if you want to get something good from it. The big challenge lies in, what are we going to do about it. We can't just sit around moaning and groaning about what we don't have. We have to move on and create for ourselves something new and exciting that really works in life. kp: Dr. Buscaglia, you've written in almost all your books that our need for love is as great as the need for air or the need for food. We all need love. lb: Even more so, you know, even more so kp: So why are we so afraid of it? As human beings why are we so afraid to reach out and love? lb: Kathryn, it's a very sad statement but we are afraid of being hurt. Every time we give of ourselves, love requires total vulnerability. Every time we extend ourselves into vulnerability, we are risking being rejected, being turned away. I like William Faulkner's statement when he said, "if I had to choose between pain and nothing, I would always chose pain." I agree with that. So what if you are rejected, you pick yourself up, you learn, you dust yourself off, you put your makeup back on, you put your coat on and you go out to try again. No one is infallible. I always say that the greatest lovers of the world have a lot of love scars all over. But that's okay because it doesn't make them any tougher; they stay vulnerable. They learn and they move forward. It's better to be hurt and alive than to be wandering the earth suspicious and dead. kp: You've also said that the number one ingredient for successful relationships is communication. Now I don't know if I'm just being sexist here but why is it men seem to have more of a challenge with open communication than women do? lb: No, I don't think you're being sexist. I think that if we were to do a scientific study on people, that you would find it is harder for men to express themselves than it is for women. Very early we are taught that that is a feminine trait. Along with the fact that men do not cry, or show their feelings, men also do not talk things out. But happily all of those things can be learned. The feminist movement helped men to finally get to the point where they are saying "I don't have to hide this vulnerability, I don't have to hide my sensitivity." "I can be who I am and this woman will be able to understand and accept me." It's only when we hide what we feel that it endangers our relationship. Just recently an article appeared in the New York Times about men who get together all over the country just to talk about their feelings. They are working to make it possible for them to transfer this ability to communicate from among men to women in a way that women will understand. kp: I see in my own relationships with men that they are often very uncomfortable with being vulnerable. Recently, I told a dear friend that a man is never more a man than when he has opened his heart fully to the woman he loves and he said, "oh, that's an interesting concept." (laughter) lb: Well, it is true and you know the men who are able to do that have found that they are more comfortable with the male role than they have ever been because it is not natural for a man to have to go through life hiding feelings, hiding the need to express his love and his gentleness. It is no more natural than it would be for a woman to hide her aggressive tendencies, the need to lead, and the need to share. I think that when we balance those off we can begin to have some very healthy relationships. kp: Dr. Buscaglia, you often talk about how important passion is. How it sparks and fuels every experience in life. Is there a formula for creating passion? lb: People who are the most well-rounded and the happiest human beings are those people who love many things with a passion and I think, again, we can learn to love things with a passion. It isn't something that is just given to a few. I think there are a lot of people who, if encouraged, would reveal their passions. But they're almost afraid to talk of the things they really feel strongly about. I think to be passionate in our culture is to seem to be naive. People are a little bit frightened by passion. They aren't comfortable with people who express themselves with genuine excitement. It always amuses me when I'm out and one of the tables in a restaurant is just having a great time laughing uproariously because someone is likely to accuse this table that's having a passionate time of either being disruptive or drunk. They can't handle the fact that here is a bunch of people feeling passionate about each other, the food and life! Kathryn, we can model passion for children and let them know early that it's alright for them to feel the wonder and the joy and to keep expressing that passion for the rest of their lives. kp: Oh, I think that's true. Do you feel this is the number one lesson parents can teach their children today? lb: Well, going back to what we talked about at the beginning, I think it's very important for children to understand that they are one of a kind. Telling them you are so unique, not only in what you look like, and what you think, but you can even be identified by your unique fingerprints. Now that's a message; you were put on this earth for a unique reason and your life should be dedicated to the process of discovering that reason, developing it and then sharing it with everyone in the world. You don't have to worry about wealth or fame. It will all come to you because you have something to give the world that will attract it and only you have this unique gift to give the world. Only you will be able to discover it, realize what it is, actualize it and then give it away. kp: Oh Doctor, that is so beautiful. You are so wonderful. You know, I'm sitting here at my kitchen table and before me I have Leo Buscaglia's Love Cookbook, and I want you to know I think it is just fabulous. lb: Oh great! I did that cookbook with Biba Caggiano who has all the wisdom when it comes to the recipes and how to deal with the food. I have a great passion for food and a great passion for cooking. But I wanted to be involved in the cookbook to let people know that one of the greatest expressions of love is to plan a meal around someone you love. To shop with them in mind, to prepare the food with all the love you could possibly muster and to serve it beautifully. That's one of the greatest compliments both to an individual person in a romance or to your friends or family. Dining together offers an opportunity to share and allow the communication process to become active. I mentioned in the book that my father never, ever, missed a meal with us. Dinner was a time for the family to get together and there were no excuses. And you know, those were the most incredible times where much of the wisdom that I gained from my parents, and much of the modeling that I saw, was centered around that dinner table. So I can't stress enough that this just is not a cookbook and it shouldn't be seen as such. It is a pleading for people to once again gather around the table and share in that magical function of the love that they feel for each other as they share a meal. kp: It's a sacred connection isn't it? I mean, basically Dr. Buscaglia, you've said that you learned to love at the dinner table. lb: Well I think basically I can say, yes. The wonderful thing about having food around which to congregate and celebrate is that you are not only nurturing your body, you're nurturing your spirit, your soul and your mind all at the same time. It is well worth the effort to get it together to do that. It is so sad that people nowadays are running in a thousand directions, the kids are going to ballet classes, tennis classes, to golf classes or to learn Spanish and they are missing what is most essential of all; the unity of wonder that comes from being a part of a family. kp: Oh, that is so true. I love this quote from the cookbook where you said, "the table seems to be one of the only places left where we willingly rest long enough to strengthen and enliven our relationships." lb: That's right, and I point that out to people who say they just don't have time, that it's better to take people out. Well, if you go out it's very nice and occasionally that's fun. But when finally the bill comes and you've had your dessert, you have to get out of there at the magic time; that wonderful moment afterwards when you sit around, push your dish away and have your last little sip of wine. Those are the magic moments within a meal where all the stuff that is so important will come out if you give it a forum, but unless you give it a place where the magic can happen, it won't. And what better day to experience this magic around the dinner table than Mother's Day! kp: Dr. Buscaglia, what better way to end our interview. This has been so wonderful. Thank you for sharing your time and passion with me today. lb: Thank you, Kathryn, and let me tell you, that you are a joy to talk with, and I feel as if I've been at your kitchen table this day! |
